112 - Diving into totally new projects

Today, Emily & Rachel talk about jumping into new projects.

What you’ll learn from this episode:

• Moving onto new projects - like a totally new set of characters, new series, etc. It's scary!!
• What it’s like to start a totally new project 
• Embrace rewriting and making decisions
• Play, have fun, and follow curiosity 

Ready to make readers so in love with your characters they can’t stop biting their nails in anticipation?  Grab The Magic of Character Arcs free email course: https://www.goldenmayediting.com/arcsmagic

Join Tenacious Writing! With the perfect combo of craft, mindset, and community resources, you will build a writing life that feels sustainable, fulfilling, and fun—without any prescriptions or rules. Learn more: https://www.tenaciouswriting.com/

If you enjoyed Story Magic, please rate, review and follow on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to this podcast!

Follow us on social media!

Rachel: https://www.instagram.com/bookcoachrachel/

Emily: https://www.instagram.com/ebgoldenbooks/

Transcript

Copy Transcript Copied

Emily: 0:00

Foreign. Hey, writers.

Rachel: 0:14

Welcome back to Story Magic, the podcast that will help you write a book you're damn proud of.

Emily: 0:18

I'm Emily.

Rachel: 0:19

And I'm Rachel.

Emily: 0:20

And today we are talking about new projects.

Rachel: 0:24

Neural projects. Should be exciting. Are they?

Emily: 0:27

Yeah. Are they? So this came from. This came from a tenacious Randing member who wanted us to talk about, like, the process of moving on to new projects. Like a totally new set of characters, a new series, you know, you're starting from scratch, essentially. And they're like, it's scary. It's totally scary.

Rachel: 0:46

Yeah, it's totally scary. It's fun. I mean, you can be. You can have fun with something and it be scary at the same time.

Emily: 0:51

Is it fun? Is that fun?

Rachel: 0:53

I think it's fun.

Emily: 0:55

I don't know.

Rachel: 0:56

I have a lot of new project ideas that I will start because, you know, I'll be annoyed with my current project and be like, oh, wow, this new project's going to be so much more fun and way easier. So then I start a new project.

Emily: 1:12

And that's not how I function.

Rachel: 1:16

That's a great. When I'm like, ooh, I should work on this instead.

Emily: 1:22

My brain has, like, tunnel, Tunnel focus. So, like, I can only work on one thing at a time. And then once that project is complete, like this last one, I sent it to my agent, and then I was like, okay, now I'm gonna start something new. And it's like the new ideas will only start to come to me at that point. But then it's like, I just. I was just in, like, the fine tuning phase of a project, and so now I'm in, like, the. The nothing phase. And, like, my brain hates that drop because that. My favorite part is the fine tuning. I love fine tuning my stories.

Rachel: 1:57

Yeah.

Emily: 1:58

So it's like, you know, a 180.

Rachel: 2:00

Well, why is it a drop?

Emily: 2:02

What's.

Rachel: 2:02

It.

Emily: 2:02

What's.

Rachel: 2:03

Are you scared? Are you a scaredy cat of new projects?

Emily: 2:07

I used to be. I don't. I'm not. I'm not scared anymore. I think partially because I have the proof that it works out. You know what I mean?

Rachel: 2:14

Yeah.

Emily: 2:15

Um. But yeah. So I just started this new. Call it Project Gold. Like, three. Three weeks ago, four weeks ago. I don't know, not that long ago. And I love the research phase. So for this one, I got really nerdy for about two weeks about a.

Rachel: 2:37

Specific topic seems relevant to this project. I know what you're talking about, but.

Emily: 2:43

I went on a field trip. I went to museum. Like. Like, I got into it. And then I got home, and I, like, wrote down all my notes and pro. You know, like, process the. The research part of it. And then I was like, oh, I actually have to make this into a book.

Rachel: 2:58

Yeah.

Emily: 2:59

And so there's, like, the exhilaration of, oh, okay, this could be my character. Like, here are my characters, and, like, this is how it could be. And then I actually started thinking about scenes, and my brain just sort of, like, implodes, I think, because I just struggle. I struggle with, like. I see too many connections between, like, all the things, you know, between the backstory and, like, what other characters are doing, what my gaming characters are doing. And so it's really hard. Like, I see all these dominoes, and I'm like, which ones do I want to put in a line? And my brain just really struggles with, like, doing that in a way where it's, like. Where it's cohesive and makes sense. And so, yeah, I just struggled with clarity at that point. Cause it's, like, all these pieces that aren't fully formed. And there's lots of options, right? The backstory could go 10 different ways, and the secondary characters could go 20 different ways. And it's like, I have to pick some, but they don't all line up right. You can't just, like, pick any option. So, yeah, it's just, like, a little overwhelming for me, I think. And it's not as fun, because what's really fun for me is when I'm. When a character feels very real, like, at the point where that clicks, and they feel like a real person to me, and I, like, get into their head and, like, sink into their experience, and I'm able to write the story in, like, a linear, cohesive way that, like, feels propulsive. Like, that's. I really love that draft. For me, that's usually, like, draft three or four, so getting there, it's just not as much fun.

Rachel: 4:23

Yeah, not as much fun. Yeah. I think the fun parts for me are. I. I hate research.

Emily: 4:32

Pass.

Rachel: 4:34

Just want to make. Shut up.

Emily: 4:36

We love literally the opposite things.

Rachel: 4:37

I know. Like, research. Meh. Who cares? I'll make it. This is a fantasy world anyway. I'm making it all up. This is a fiction. It doesn't have to be real. So pass on research. Unless it's, like, I'm making a Pinterest board. I'm gonna do all the fun things. I really like. I really like doing the fun parts, but I love making the characters I, like, love. Like, I'll just start writing, like, scene Ideas that come to me, but when I. I am a very quick giver upper when things get no longer fun.

Emily: 5:18

So.

Rachel: 5:20

But when that happens, I think it's probably at the same point that we both have of decision fatigue. I think there are so many choices that you have make when you're writing a story that it. For me, when the choices are like, easy, they're subconscious choices, so they don't feel like choices, but like, I'm making a character who's sassy and biting and. And, you know, really likes to set things on fire. That's fun part. Those are choices. But like, it didn't feel like that. Those were just ideas that came to me. But then when I'm like, ugh, what is this plot about? Yeah, Warring quit.

Emily: 5:56

Well, it's moving on. It's not even the plot. It's like, so my current opening chapter, which I think I'm probably gonna change. My main character's like, running to catch a train and there's guys, like, chasing her. Right. And so at that point I'm like, okay, I have to make all these decisions. Does she have any money? Right. Because if she has money, then the story can go in these 200 directions. If she doesn't have money, they can go in these 200 directions. And like, who are the guys after her? Are they assassins or are they, like, the actual guys who are after her? Or are they, like, random guys who have to, you know, like, I. It's like those decisions that have all these ripple effects and I'm like, I can't, I can't. It's too many. It's all little tiny things. What is she wearing? You know, does she look high class or low class? You know, like, how are people looking at her?

Rachel: 6:45

Yes.

Emily: 6:45

Like, too much. It's too much.

Rachel: 6:47

I know. That's what I'm talking about with, like, plot. You have to, like, that's what I mean of like, you're. Once you have to start making a bunch of decisions that haven't already. Like, for me, it's vibes. Like, I just feel it out then. And if I. The. The parts that I can feel out, the vibes are the easy, fun part. But as soon as I'm in the weeds and like, trying to put these little pieces together, all the tiny little decisions, I think that's when it becomes harder and that's when it feels scarier.

Emily: 7:14

Yeah.

Rachel: 7:15

To make those choices. Because then you're like, well, what if it's the wrong choice? What if she's. She does have money? And then I take her down this path, and then I don't like it.

Emily: 7:26

Yeah.

Rachel: 7:27

And then what?

Emily: 7:27

It doesn't work. Which is what happened. She had too much money, and there wasn't enough. There wasn't enough obstacles in her way. So now we're backing up. We're rewriting the first five chapters again to show that she doesn't have money. Like.

Rachel: 7:43

You know, I'm going to be. It's not like I haven't been in your shoes. But also, that sounds really exhausting.

Emily: 7:52

So tiring. And I do feel like that's the one thing maybe about sequels that you don't have to do. There are a lot of problems with sequels, but, like, there are, like, certain things about characters and backstory that at least you don't have to be, like, well, pre established. But I feel like this. This relates back to our last podcast about rewriting, because this has been the most fun I have had with the first five chapters of the zero draft ever. And that's because I'm. I've accepted the fact that, like, I'm gonna make small decisions, like, does she have money or does she not? You know, like, I chose that she had money, and I wrote four chapters, and I was like, okay, this isn't the direction I want her to go, so I'm gonna back up and, like, change it. And I'm only doing that because. Not from a place of perfectionism, but from a place of. I'm trying to figure out how to enter the story, and I just don't have an answer yet for the direction that I want to go and, like, how I want the tens. Um, so just caveat that, like, you don't want to get stuck in a cycle of doing this that keeps you from finishing a draft. But I do feel like the more that you accept rewriting.

Rachel: 8:55

Yes.

Emily: 8:56

The easier rewriting becomes, because then you're just like, well, okay, tried that. Let's try something else. Um, and it's. Yeah. And I've moved it. You know, it's only been, like, three weeks. And I've rewritten my. I mean, it's only like, 5,000 words. I've rewritten my first 5,000 words a few times, trying to figure out the way in. But it doesn't feel as painful as before because I feel like for previous drafts, I've done this same thing, but the process has been riddled with the fear of. That I was wasting time.

Rachel: 9:26

Yes.

Emily: 9:26

And it's like, it's not a waste of time. That's exploring how you're going to enter the story.

Rachel: 9:30

Yes. It's exactly like the whole concept. This is again what we talked about in our lab in our last episode. But the whole concept of wasting time in. In writing is non existent, irrelevant. It doesn't happen. Everything that you're doing, like, is more information that you need to finish the story that you want. So like, there it is a total myth that like I. I have yet to come across a scenario that truly feels like a waste of time.

Emily: 10:02

I feel like if anything feels like a waste of time, it's when people get stuck in the fear.

Rachel: 10:07

Yes.

Emily: 10:07

Like that is that situation.

Rachel: 10:08

Yeah.

Emily: 10:08

Wasting your time if you're trying to make it perfect. Yes.

Rachel: 10:11

That's the true ace. The true ace is like the overthinking, the fear of committing the time you waste, like crushed under the weight and expectations of like a new project. It has to be just as good as what I just wrote, which was draft nine. And now I have to write a book that's just as good as draft nine or else. Like, I think that's. Those are the times where your brain will like, you're not spending the right amount of time in the right places.

Emily: 10:45

Yeah. I feel like was my last project. If I wasted any time, it was at the beginning when I was trying to make every line perfect and like make the prose perfect. Cause I had just come off of line editing.

Rachel: 10:56

Yes.

Emily: 10:56

And like that was a waste. Like, sure, I used a lot of those lines. You know, they, they've re. Knit, been recycled, you know, repurposed. They've popped up in other places. But ultimately, you know, like, if I had just let it be messy, it would have gotten there faster.

Rachel: 11:14

Yes.

Emily: 11:15

But you know, you live and you learn. It's not a waste of time if you're learning. If you're learning you mindset stuff.

Rachel: 11:21

Yeah. I mean, when you're, when you're going from like one finished project and that, that could look at any certain way. I mean like, maybe you're tabling a project. Maybe you're, you're querying this project. Maybe you're, you've published it and it's done.

Emily: 11:35

Whatever.

Rachel: 11:36

When you're moving from one to two projects, then when you get to the second project, you're like, can I still do it? Was the first time, like a fluke is what is my process? I don't remember. The first time was so hard. What is the second time? I can make up whatever I want, but I don't know what I'm doing. So like one to two is really strange because it's. You're. It's not just like, like all the. All the stuff you've just done to make one as good as it was, you're still trying to bring that over. You're still learning, like, new process. You're probably still solidifying different habits or trying out new things. But then there's all this weight of, like, can I really do it again? Was it a fluke? But then when you go from two to three, like, you finish project two, you're now in project three. I think it's less. I think it's a little different. You're like, well, I did this twice already. I don't know. Yeah, I'll do it again. Sure. And then when you go from like three to four, I think it just gets better each time because you're able to prove to yourself that you've done it and it's less scary. And I'm not. Like, my books, the three that are published in the one I'm working on now are series. So with that, like, we've talked about comes with, like, I. Those were not brand new projects, but guys on the side. I got two different projects going. Like, I'm working on two random other things. So really, I don't even know if.

Emily: 13:06

I know about both of them.

Rachel: 13:09

I've got Fallon's book, and then I've got this other little secret one that's like, just for me. Whenever I have ideas about it that I, like, write it down. And I guess it's not that secret. There's a. There's a. This is so silly. So, like, guys, this is beginning ideas. Okay? But I did write a plot summary for it, so that's exciting.

Emily: 13:29

Oh.

Rachel: 13:29

But in where I used to live, and in the old town where I used to live, there's a biker garage, like, for, like, like bicycle. Like motorbikes or like motorcycles. And I never see anyone there. And I would always be like, who goes to this? And it's got, like, this really, like, edgy name. And I'm like, that is a biker garage that needs to be in a romance novel. It definitely does. So I. This is just for fun. Okay, Everybody get off me. This is just for fun. But I. I have this idea where, like, this romance novelist is like, I want to write a romance novel about a biker bar. Because there's a whole genre of biker romance. So she goes into the biker garage and then has a roman.

Emily: 14:20

I said, I love that so much.

Rachel: 14:23

And so then it's a whole, like. So she's a romance author. Nobody steal this. Okay?

Emily: 14:31

I'm like, do you really want to tell everybody?

Rachel: 14:33

I just really like it. It's really fun.

Emily: 14:35

It's really cute.

Rachel: 14:36

She has, like. She has, like, a stalker. So then her new biker boyfriends have to protect her from this stalker because she's an author who exists on the Internet. And we all get really weird comments and DMs all the time. So she has this, like, stalker. And I love that her biker guys have.

Emily: 14:56

You know a lot about this.

Rachel: 14:58

I know. Don't take it. Everybody. Don't write this. I'm writing it. It's mine. So that's why I like a little secret project. But see why I really like it right now? Is it in the fun stage? This is the ideas stage.

Emily: 15:15

Yeah.

Rachel: 15:16

And then I wrote. You're all getting a sneak peek. Because I'm just updating Emily on what I've been up to. I have all of the characters. I wrote the first two scenes of this.

Emily: 15:35

Wow.

Rachel: 15:37

I have, like, played with the. The main character and the guys. And, like, it's all kind of. I see this biker bar that I'm like. Or this biker garage that I'm like. That definitely is a front for something because no one's ever there anyway. But, like, it's fun. It's fun. And I think when. If I ever put full effort into it, where it will become less fun is back when I will have to start, like, making decisions about where I want this book to go. Because now its potential is unlimited. It could be anything.

Emily: 16:19

I love it. I've always wanted to. I think it was Charlie. Charlie Jane Anders. Anders. Thank you. I was like, what is her last name? Charlie Jane Anders talks about how she has the. The like, secret project. It's like the. The heart project. Yeah. To do at night, after the day, work is done. And I've always loved that idea. I mean, that sounds a lot like what your biker bar idea is of, like sometimes the heaviness of the current project. Right. Because you're in it. You're in that decision making. You're in that. You know, that. That heavy part of it. It's not always fun. Can be. You know, you can kind of offset that with some. Some fun project that you just secretly work on in your. In your free time. I've always wanted to do that and always, like, almost felt like I should be able to, but that doesn't work for me sometimes.

Rachel: 17:15

It doesn't.

Emily: 17:15

I'm an all in or all out kind of person. Yeah.

Rachel: 17:19

I mean, I feel like, okay, you're gonna laugh at this. So last night I had my writing group, and I've been, like, tandem writing Fallon's book at the same time that I've been writing, like, books three and four of the Shadows Syndicate. So Fallon has been on the back burner for quite a while. So I've put, like, a decent amount of thought and effort into it. And I've been writing chapters of Fallon's book to submit to my writing group. But I reached the point of, like, these were all my ideas. And we ran. These were, like, chapters one through four. I knew what was going to happen now what? So I went to my writing group last night, and they were so helpful, and we brainstormed a bunch of different scene ideas. And then once I got off the call, I put them all in order in a plot summary, and it was like, there's a plot. I have a plot for Fallon. And I wrote Fallon's first scene or another scene for Fallon last night. So I did all of that. Just, like, burst of ADHD hyper focus. There it is. And I was joking with him last night that I'm gonna do a double nano. I'm gonna do one nano for Phallus.

Emily: 18:28

You guys should see my face right now.

Rachel: 18:30

You should see only's face. You're probably making the same one. I'm gonna do it One nano for Fallon's book and one nano for.

Emily: 18:42

So one is knob nov and one is no shame. November.

Rachel: 18:45

Writing a hundred thousand words in November. Okay, I know it's not gonna happen, but, like, that's the energy right now.

Emily: 18:57

I love it.

Rachel: 18:58

But when I was doing Fallon's stuff last night, I was like, leona's book is going on pause. I'm going to write all of Fallon's book before I go back. And then obviously, I can't do that because I actually have to deliver the book that's been promised. So I have to write Leona's book. But I. My point that what I'm trying to say is, like, I will get really hyper focused on one project and feel like I have a ton of clarity on it, and then I'll have to switch back to, like, the project I really should be working on and feel a little disconnected to it. So I. You. I. It is very hard for me, like you've said to me, to do both at once. It does. I. I cannot really juggle both at once in. At a consistent pace. It's like, I will be focused on one, like, 95%, and then, like, one day I will write three scenes of another book.

Emily: 20:03

I love it. Some people can juggle. It's. Some people can. Susan Dennard juggles. She talks about it a lot in her substack. She's just like, goes with the vibes of whatever she feels like working on that day. She's got like three or four projects going at once. And I. That's just not how my brain works.

Rachel: 20:20

But mine either.

Emily: 20:22

But yeah, if you're. I feel like this question and this topic is especially relevant if you have finished your first project.

Rachel: 20:32

Yes.

Emily: 20:33

Like, brought it to completion and now you're like, oh, my goodness, I was just in copy edits and now I have to go back to. To nothing.

Rachel: 20:40

Yeah.

Emily: 20:40

Um, and so I guess my. My tips for you if you're in that place are to embrace the rewriting, embrace the play, and to follow curiosity. That's like. I feel like that's my. At this point in the process, that's kind of my goal is like, where what sounds fun? What sounds fun to do right now? And then I'll do that. Or I'll ask myself, what do I have clarity on? And you know, what little piece do I feel like right now feels right. And how can I take that one step further? So curiosity, clarity, and then like, what is a question I need to answer in order to be able to move forward? Sometimes I'll ask myself that question and that'll be my assignment for the. You know, my task for the day is like, come up with an answer for this thing that's blocking me and then, you know, move forward from there. So it's really just like, you gotta take it one step at a time and just like embrace the confusion because you don't have the answers right. Our books aren't like out there perfectly formed. We just have to find them. Like, we create them one piece, one decision at a time. And so the more that you can kind of like sink back and like let that be true, I think the easier it will be.

Rachel: 22:00

Yes. If you're finding yourself, like, think like getting. It's not always super apparent, but try to have some self awareness as far as your critiques about yourself with like, these words don't sound as good or. I ha. Have I lost my ability to write? I don't know what I'm doing. I feel like it. That. That sentiment. That feeling always happens. I have no clue what I'm doing. I thought I just wrote a book. I have no clue what I'm doing. That normal, totally normal. And then I think this is really helpful to talk about with other writing friends to share and like, oh, yeah, it's really strange to spend so much time tightening up one thing and then move to something that is bones bear. And your words don't sound as great because you haven't been, you know, staring at them for two years. Of course they don't.

Emily: 23:03

Of course.

Rachel: 23:04

Take like a deep breath, have fun. And I, I always, I am always going to agree with the advice of, like, following your gut, following your curiosity, doing what feels good. And when you hit like that, that moment of I don't want to or I'm stuck or I don't know what to do next, like, don't freak out and just take a step back and try to let go of any pressure, if there is any. But, like, think about, what do I need right now? You know, what one decision can I make right now that can move me forward? It's just as you said, knowing that.

Emily: 23:54

You might throw that decision. She won't have money in three days. You just have to make a choice and follow it through and be willing to change it if you decide to later. I think that's like, yeah, if only it were that easy. But that's what we got.

Rachel: 24:12

That's what we got. Good luck, everybody. Have fun. If you want to build a successful, fulfilling and sustainable writing life that works for you, you've got to get on our email list.

Emily: 24:23

Sign up now to get our free email course, the Magic of Character Arcs. After seven days of email magic, you'll have the power to keep your readers slipping pages all through the night.

Rachel: 24:32

Link in the show notes. We'll see you there.

Emily: 24:35

It.